Replies (2)

• @ricci@discuss.systems 2026-06-21 21:06

  @dialecticalmusings @cwebber@social.coop @innocentzero@social.tchncs.de I partially agree and partially disagree. I agree that moderation load on fediverse instances can be high, and demonstrably leads to burn out. I think "the entire network" is overstating it; they only have to moderate the fraction of the network their users interact with. Which yes, can be a lot. But it scales linearly in the number of users, and one reason many folks tend to argue for relatively small instances. What you get in return is the ability to create and maintain community standards. Yes, you can run a PDS, in which case you are offloading almost all moderation to others. But you are just a data host. You cannot form a community with a PDS alone, and you are feeding that data into a service that must try to enforce some sort of global homogeneous notion of "community standards", which is the moderation scaling problem that many people are trying to avoid by using decentralized social networks. If you want to form a community, with standards, you either need to run an appview, in which case you are truly moderating the *entire* network, not just the portion your users interact with; or you use the labeling tools available on eg. the Bluesky appview, which are cool but are not really good for community formation. My recent conversations over on Bluesky have led me to the conclusion that, so far, people building on atproto tend (with exceptions) to think of themselves as building products, and people building on activitypub tend of thing of themselves as building communities. These are both fine, if that's what you want as a developer or user. The difference in moderation load comes from the fact that it's fundamentally different to bring your own data storage to someone else's product than it is to host a community. I think this is largely in line with what you are saying, but I think it's important to understand how different they are.

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• @jupiter_rowland@hub.netzgemeinde.eu 2026-06-22 05:39

  @arvind@app.wafrn.net @@cwebber@social.coop @@innocentzero@social.tchncs.de @@ricci@discuss.systems This, by the way, is why Hubzilla and its descendants have the pubstream deactivated by default, and why most owners of public servers refuse to turn it on. Users are encouraged and empowered to moderate their own streams and contacts and given a variety of tools to do so, much unlike Mastodon that only gives you "mute", "block" and "call a moderator". But there simply is no realistic way for the admin to moderate the pubstream. So the obvious solution is there not being a pubstream in the first place. Fortunately, the pubstream is optional, it's even off by default, and if it's on, it can be switched between what corresponds to Mastodon's local timeline and what corresponds to Mastodon's federated timeline. Coincidentally, Hubzilla and its descendants are also the only fully nomadic Fediverse server applications and capable of things that aren't possible even with the AT protocol. #Long #LongPost #CWLong #CWLongPost #FediMeta #FediverseMeta #CWFediMeta #CWFediverseMeta #Hubzilla #Streams #(streams) #Forte #PublicStream #Moderation

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